Help Me with the Celestial Tournament

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Flopsyhunt
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Re: Help Me with the Celestial Tournament

Post by Flopsyhunt » February 7th, 2014, 9:12 pm

Kpb321 wrote:There is no Magic decoder ring of pets you have to have leveled or exact sequence of attacks you have to use to beat the tournament. Yes you have to have a plan and use a strategy to beat it but there many different strategies for each fight and for many of those a large number of options for pets you can use for that strategy. Some strategies might be faster or more reliable but that doesn't mean that there is one right strategy you have to use.
You still note a limited number of pets that work. You make my point while claiming it is not there. You cannot succeed with any set of pets, you have to have specific ones, many that are quite challenging to get. Then you have to level the exact right ones. That may appeal to you, though I am not sure how it is appealing once you have solved it, but it does not appeal to us.
Kendrah wrote:
Flopsyhunt wrote:Which addon shows the enemy's abilities? I could not find that. I have a bunch of pet addons already and they almost conflict with each other at this point.
Pet tracker tells you what talents they pets have. http://www.curse.com/addons/wow/pettracker
Thanks. I added that to my list.

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Tiggindy
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Re: Help Me with the Celestial Tournament

Post by Tiggindy » February 7th, 2014, 9:47 pm

Kpb321 wrote:There is no Magic decoder ring of pets you have to have leveled or exact sequence of attacks you have to use to beat the tournament.
Depends on what is meant by Magic decoder ring and so on.

The fact that these are NPCs, and they have certain patterns, that's the code. The decode is determining what moves you want to be using to counter them, which actually does dictate what sequence you make your moves.

It's a matter of finding (or making) a strategy that works for you. However, since these are "top end" and there's some luck factor involved, you sometimes need to have a backup team/strat for any particular fight.
there many different strategies for each fight and for many of those a large number of options for pets you can use for that strategy.
Personally, I stopped paying attention once I had my teams set, after which it was just a matter of chugging away til I got all the pets.

However, I've gotta question your use of "many" for the tourney fights.
I almost wish that during the beta instead of decreasing it from 30 to 15 that they would have increased it to 45 or 60 which might have set a more realistic expectation on what your collection needed to look like to be successful.
I agree here, they should have made the minimum 25 pets (3 per fight), even if you didn't necessarily need to use all 25.

In any case, not to dis Flopsyhunt, but based on the posts in my thread, he's looking for a clear path through this. Breeds adds a level of complexity (and possible failure) that I managed to ignore until he was having trouble with some of the things I'd suggested, which made me understand that breeds is important. Which may also be some of the trouble he's having with other posted strats, and why he's frustrated when the response is "well, it works for me" from several different directions.

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Jerebear
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Re: Help Me with the Celestial Tournament

Post by Jerebear » February 7th, 2014, 10:02 pm

Not to disagree with you Tiggindy, but what would be your definition of "many" for the tourney. I've seen well over 10 different approaches to each enemy team (except for Chi-Chi). I wouldn't be surprised if there still many more not discovered or published in a guide. And if you consider some pets are essentially duplicates of others, that opens up the options more. My own experience would support the "many" idea, but it's just my own experience and I might define it differently than you do.
Tiggindy wrote: The fact that these are NPCs, and they have certain patterns, that's the code. The decode is determining what moves you want to be using to counter them, which actually does dictate what sequence you make your moves.
I think this is the key thing to understand and why I disagree with Flopsyhunt to an extent. His use of decoder ring centers around needing specific pets. I think that is not correct. I would argue (and hopefully agree with your statement if I understand it) that the decoder ring is understanding a specific enemy team and countering the mechanics. I think that opens up the options on what is "required" to do the tournament.


EDIT: This is not meant to be offensive. I apologize if so. I'm being very specific with my wording because I think we each have different ideas about what certain phrases/words mean.
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Re: Help Me with the Celestial Tournament

Post by Tiggindy » February 7th, 2014, 10:17 pm

Jerebear wrote:Not to disagree with you Tiggindy, but what would be your definition of "many" for the tourney. I've seen well over 10 different approaches to each enemy team (except for Chi-Chi).
Fair enough. I did say I stopped paying attention once I had my strategies down. :P :lol:

10+ constitutes many, I was thinking there were 5 or 6.
I think this is the key thing to understand and why I disagree with Flopsyhunt to an extent. His use of decoder ring centers around needing specific pets.
Well, technically, you do need specific pets. For instance, for any given week, I've got my list of 21 pets I would use (12 "fixed", 9 rotating with some cross over for the 9), with the potential for 1 or two backup teams in case of "luck".
I would argue (and hopefully agree with your statement if I understand it) that the decoder ring is understanding a specific enemy team and countering the mechanics. I think that opens up the options on what is "required" to do the tournament.
That's basically it. Once you understand what the enemy is doing, you have to have a good understanding of what counters those moves. You can then pick pets that can do what you want, and go from there. The problem is that everyone has their own favorites and go-to pets that they try first, so my counter approach is gonna be different than your counter approach, even though the end result is we both got our coins.

The other issue is that not everyone gets into the nitty gritty enough to know/understand all of the various moves, and doesn't understand which moves are identical with only name/family changed and so on. There's a LOT of stuff to remember.

Flopsyhunt is a fan, but he's not a fanatic. I don't think he can call this info to mind as readily as others do (and there's definitely peeps here that are further down the rabbit hole than I am too :lol: ).

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Re: Help Me with the Celestial Tournament

Post by Kpb321 » February 7th, 2014, 10:58 pm

Flopsyhunt wrote:You still note a limited number of pets that work. You make my point while claiming it is not there. You cannot succeed with any set of pets, you have to have specific ones, many that are quite challenging to get. Then you have to level the exact right ones. That may appeal to you, though I am not sure how it is appealing once you have solved it, but it does not appeal to us.
I have to disagree. There is a difference between needing a team and a strategy and a "magic decoder ring of hard to get pets". I'll use one example to illustrate my point.

Xu-fu. The strategy I use for him is basically the following. Any pet that can cast call lighting, any flying pet with swarm or flock that is faster than him with out their racial and almost any mechanical pet. Doing some quick searches on the site here show there are 10 pets with call lighting that range from capturable wild pets up to the rare and hard to get dragonkite. There are 8 flying pets that meet that criteria and there are 35 mechanical pets but lets say 30 total that have a good spammable mechanical attack. That is almost 50 pets in total for one strategy and you could actually fit a lot more pets in there. A flying pet that is slower will work but leaves you with only 1 round of the debuff up. A wolf pet with howl would work you just have to time it right and again you loose a round if your not faster. Lil'blingtron works well. That is one strategy and there are numerous others that work against him.

If there was a fight out there that truly did require a very small set of pets that were hard to get I'd be right there with you screaming about how horrible it was but CT just isn't that.

If you don't like building a team and planning a strategy and see having to do that as pet battles being a failure then I don't know what to say other than pet battles may not be your thing then.

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Re: Help Me with the Celestial Tournament

Post by Elfuego » February 13th, 2014, 5:59 pm

Genome, GREAT detailed guide for those looking for some alternatives! I've looked into the chrominius/pool combo, not all the damage ever resolves, because the pets cant take more then 35% of their health in one shot, or the tourney would be pretty simple. I wanted to one shot Chi Chi with my Darkness + Howl + Prowl+ Spectral strike combo, it hits Yon the corageous's Pequin pet for 6k ( hitting chi chi for around 3k), but the buff went off and mitigates all the rest of the damage with chichi. I was so looking forward to posting a one shot =(. The reason the spider burn works so well is each swarm is its own damage, hitting anywhere from 3-600 dmg each. Ive noticed the B/B spiders in particular often kill xufu and zao alone when one or two of the swarms go critical.

But over all great reply Gnome!

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Kpb321
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Re: Help Me with the Celestial Tournament

Post by Kpb321 » February 13th, 2014, 6:16 pm

Elfuego wrote:Genome, GREAT detailed guide for those looking for some alternatives! I've looked into the chrominius/pool combo, not all the damage ever resolves, because the pets cant take more then 35% of their health in one shot, or the tourney would be pretty simple.
The combo still works because you have three hits all of which should be capped to the 35% which means you are doing 105% of their total health. Whirlpool + Geyser + Surge of Power = dead. Luckily Chi-chi never has her heal running at that point or it might not work.

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Re: Help Me with the Celestial Tournament

Post by Jerebear » February 13th, 2014, 6:50 pm

Genome wrote:E
Chi-Chi - [pet]Pandaren Water Spirit[/pet] / [pet]Chrominius[/pet] / [pet]Nexus Whelpling[/pet]. The most valuable fight to have [pet]Chrominius[/pet] for, and the only one where will take any dmg at all, but he will be pretty close to death by the end of the fight. Whelpling is really only on there as a JiCP. Start with Water Spirit, just pass first round as Chi-Chi will just heal anyway. Round two, [ability]Geyser[/ability]. Round three (evasion round) [ability]Whirlpool[/ability]. Switch [pet]Chrominius[/pet] in. [ability]Howl[/ability]. Traps both go off onto debuffed Chi-Chi, dealing big dmg and stunning him for one round. Debuff is still up, so [ability]Surge of Power[/ability] to finish him off.
Just as a side note, there is no reason to pass the first round ever (if anything passing makes you take more damage):

R1: Geyser, Chi-Chi renews
R2: Whirlpool, Chi-Chi attacks
R3: Swap, Chi-Chi ethereals
R4: Howl, Chi-Chi attacks, Geyser+Whirlpool go off stunning chi-chi
R5: Surge of power kills Chi-Chi

Never fails, even if chi-chi crits on all of his attacks.
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Re: Help Me with the Celestial Tournament

Post by Arshadi » February 14th, 2014, 8:01 am

To the OP -

As Kpb321 says in their post above:
"If you don't like building a team and planning a strategy and see having to do that as pet battles being a failure then I don't know what to say other than pet battles may not be your thing then."

This is the crux of it. From your posts here and on the pet battle boards on battle.net, it seems clear that you have built up a set of beliefs and assumptions about the Celestial Tournament. Some are based on personalized factors and some on incorrect information. But you seem notably unwilling to budge from your perspective.

Not every aspect of the game will suit every player. Your best bet is to take the quote above to heart and honestly assess whether you actually want to do the Tournament or if it may be something not suited to your particular playstyle and preferences. But engaging in a pretty much circular debate here with folks about how horrible it is - regardless of any facts they share or helpful information they provide - won't be productive for anyone, including you.

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Re: Help Me with the Celestial Tournament

Post by Genome » February 14th, 2014, 6:23 pm

Jerebear wrote:Just as a side note, there is no reason to pass the first round ever (if anything passing makes you take more damage):

R1: Geyser, Chi-Chi renews
R2: Whirlpool, Chi-Chi attacks
R3: Swap, Chi-Chi ethereals
R4: Howl, Chi-Chi attacks, Geyser+Whirlpool go off stunning chi-chi
R5: Surge of power kills Chi-Chi

Never fails, even if chi-chi crits on all of his attacks.
This is correct. I realized (after posting from memory...drat!), that there is indeed no reason to pass on round one. This means that [pet]Chrominus[/pet] will finish up around half-health. Good catch!

Something else I will add is that my Xu-Fu team is also my Lilttle Tommy Newcomer daily team as well. Start with Inflation, get switched by [pet]Lil' Ondoosta[/pet], Custodian gets brought to the front [ability]Zap[/ability] -> [ability]Ion Cannon[/ability] watch Custodian die. Bling Inflations again and dies. Chrominus [ability]Surge of Power[/ability] and that is game. The funny thing is, this strat works every time unless the dino misses one of his attacks.

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