Mechanics & Formulas

Discuss pet battles, strategy and theorycrafting.
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Paladance
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Re: Mechanics & Formulas

Post by Paladance » November 19th, 2017, 8:02 am

There surely is a sequence. I think I have described it before, but it was unfinished. The only thing I have noted after that was that [ability]Chew[/ability]'s proc happens before stuns caused by opponent's [ability]Ice Tomb[/ability], perhaps workalikes aswell.

0. Effects from a hostile source that change your pet's resistance. Currently only [ability]Rot[/ability] proc.
1a. Abilities that always go first due to the increased speed value.
1b. Standard attacks of the first and second pet.
2. Delayed effects like Whirlpool or Geyser. Devour/Ravage's healing too, as I'm always annoyed when my cat gets a DoT. Wrrrr.
3. Technical damage over time -- effects that are both halved while against aquatics and can't be avoided by dodges due to the aura stuck to the wearer.
4. Healing over time.

So Chew proc should go between 1 and 2.

Things to place on the temporal axis:
  • Whether the traps' timing is random.
  • Where do [ability]Curse of Doom[/ability], [ability]Agony[/ability], etc. procs belong (2 or 3, or inbetween).
  • Whether [ability]Whirlpool[/ability]/[ability]Geyser[/ability] and turrets undergo the same rules.
  • [ability]Sons of the Root[/ability] and lookalikes.
  • [ability]Wish[/ability]. I was experiencing some unclear moments back then.
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Bickus
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Re: Mechanics & Formulas

Post by Bickus » November 22nd, 2017, 1:18 am

Alright, i will keep this in mind by doing this dynamically. I bind the effects of a spell (e.g. direct hit-component to 1b, dot to 3) to a state (and a precise round), so it can be moved around quickly.

I didnt test it so far as i focus on the implementation of basics, but some things seem kinda quirky:

What about healing spells? Some change the school (e.g. Nature´s Ward: x => elementary) of the target on "hit". Does this impact the amount of healing?

Regarding crit: There is a state(=buff) which increases the critchance by 50%. Therefore
a) Basecritchance*buffchance (=> 5%*1.5 = 7.5%)?
b) does it add it (=> 5%+50% = 55%)?
c) or are these "points" (=> 5% + (50 points=5%) = 10% critchance)?

If i increase via an ability my maxhealth (i believe there is an ability, cant find it) temporarily, and get hit by an ability which decreases hp by 10% -> will the 10% be based on the increased hp or my base_hp?

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Rosqo
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Re: Mechanics & Formulas

Post by Rosqo » November 22nd, 2017, 8:51 am

The percentages in pet battles are additive so 5% crit + 50% additional crit = 55% total crit.

Flat % dmg abilities aren’t effected though.

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Jerebear
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Re: Mechanics & Formulas

Post by Jerebear » November 22nd, 2017, 6:12 pm

Caviate to that:
Percentages of buffs and debuffs on the same pet are additive. If one pet has a buff and the other pet a debuff of the same type, they are multiplicative.

Example:

If pet A has Shattered defenses and crouch up, those are additive because they are on the same pet. However if pet B has supercharge, it's effect is multiplicative. IE the damage on pet A is

(1 + 1.00 - 0.50) * (1 + 1.25) = 3.375x damage

as opposed to:

(1 + 1.00 - 0.50 + 1.25) = 2.750x damage
Carry Pet Experience Reference Guide:
http://www.warcraftpets.com/community/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=8829

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Paladance
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Re: Mechanics & Formulas

Post by Paladance » November 25th, 2017, 12:48 pm

Bickus wrote:If i increase via an ability my maxhealth (i believe there is an ability, cant find it) temporarily, and get hit by an ability which decreases hp by 10% -> will the 10% be based on the increased hp or my base_hp?
Treat the total HP as displayed at the time of your Sunny Day, [ability]Ancient Blessing[/ability] etc (so increased one). Debuffs such as a [ability]Glowing Toxin[/ability] apply to the new value until the bonus is gone. Ditto the [ability]Explode[/ability] output, magic racial barrier or even humanoid healing.
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Drlambda
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Re: Mechanics & Formulas

Post by Drlambda » November 25th, 2017, 4:01 pm

I'd say that the vast majority of all trainer battles are strictly sequence-based, with the only variance coming from CCs like Rosqo correctly said, in which case they'll swap in the next pet in line and use their sequence. If the battle is not a trainer battle (per example Argus elites) that swap will not happen and they'll pass and then continue where they stopped.

Some trainers have some very small priority-based moves. Most of them will fall into normal sequences afterwards. Examples i know of:
Christoph VonFeasel: The trihorn will use a damaging ability if your pet is under 25%hp and Trihorn Shield otherwise.
Mo'ruk: The turtle will, depending on something i'm unaware of, sometimes bind you first before headbutting you and sometimes headbutt you first. After that, it'll use Headbutt on cooldown.
The legendary trainer in Draenor: Latern will use Wish if her HP are below 50% at the beginning of the turn.

And then there are the completely random trainers which pretty much emulate rolling your face on the keyboard. These are all wild battles, Crysa, Jeremy Feasel and possibly others.
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Paladance
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Re: Mechanics & Formulas

Post by Paladance » November 27th, 2017, 12:29 am

Drlambda wrote:Some trainers have some very small priority-based moves. Most of them will fall into normal sequences afterwards. Examples i know of:
Great idea to list that!
The legendary trainer in Draenor: Latern will use Wish if her HP are below 50% at the beginning of the turn.
Ditto with Salad (Erris/Kura pet) and their [ability]Consume Corpse[/ability]. And that Sissix' elemental casts first [ability]Healing Wave[/ability] when damaged for a certain amount (perhaps the ability one, but can be slightly less -- watch out for speed). Pixiebell's [ability]Life Exchange[/ability] is a riddle wrapped in a mystery inside an enigma, considering it can benefit you -- but it bases on a particularly low amount of her HP.
Also, add all pets with [ability]Dark Rebirth[/ability] to that.

Regarding Jeremy Feasel, Judgment starts from [ability]Darkmoon Curse[/ability] and Fezwick always stuns first. Otherwise, yep.
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Re: Mechanics & Formulas

Post by Jackozzo » September 27th, 2018, 5:11 pm

Yes I totally forgot to put a link for the current code because I had to start my real job so this went aside. I still can't put it because I need 8 posts before putting links but I'll do it shortly.

I fixed some issued to correct it for BfA and enhanced tables, I was working on battle UI but if someone which knows Java is willing to help me with writing the mechanics it would be nice! Most of the data is already structured and ready to be tested/implemented :)

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Uduwudu
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Re: Mechanics & Formulas

Post by Uduwudu » September 29th, 2018, 11:08 pm

Paladance wrote:Good luck! I'm sure if you manage to do that, you'll become one who takes an important place in the pet battle community and history. :)
...
And Blizzard will immediately either change all the battles or kill the whole thing.

I like the idea of Wowhead and this place having good information for which pets to use and such, but really, that is enough. I'm not sure that Blizzard would enjoy someone breaking it down that far, and then us expecting them not to do anything about them ... programmers, are not dumb, and many of them frequent a lot of these battlegrounds (ie, bulletin boards) as a way to get ideas and also get a sense of what folks are feeling and seeing and working.

There are, in the history of this game in Pet Battling, many examples as to how Blizzard responded to folks taking on the Tamers and such, to the point that those in the Tanaan Jungle, for example, are very tough to take down ... those pets are "prepared" for almost anything that you can thrown them! You really have to know your pets and how to dissipate the incoming damage from these opponents. By comparison, the Argus' Tamers are much easier.

I like the idea of us being strong enough to learn things, but at a certain point, I think that it will hurt the game, and then, in the end, we will end up with a terrible fight, like the one with "ShowEQ" in the old Everquest game, that pretty much destroyed the game and brought a slew of folks from that game to World of Warcraft.

It's a tough call either way ... I might even suggest that you put together a nice treatise and copyright it, and then present it to Blizzard as a potential employment idea, since in a game like theirs, programmers with ideas and abilities are not exactly sent out, and often are added to the mold, to help make the game better and stronger.

I really, honestly, do not know if this is good or not, and while interesting and challenging, the results scare me ... but it might just be this old fuddy daddy worrying about doggy doo! :lol:

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