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Why pet battles fail

Discuss pet battles, strategy and theorycrafting.
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Ryanpounce
 
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Why pet battles fail

Postby Ryanpounce » January 28th, 2014, 6:41 pm

Some of you may have seen my post about why the celestial tournament is bull shit which I still think it's kinda bull but this isn't directly about that (thanks for all of the tips btw). One thing I learned from the celestial tournament is no matter how solid you think your pet team is you will still loose a lot, here's an example. I have a pet team consisting of Xu-Fu (my new favorite pet) Yellow Moth and A Golden Civet (speed). I'm using this team to counter wise mari. I have the ability to solo his team with only Xu-Fu and all of my other pets at full health at the end of the fight. But I can also lose and still have one of his pets at 100% hp and the other at 50% hp, what the? This is using the same exact abilities, the only factor here is luck. A system like this is clearly broken. I would record it but every time I pirate fraps it gets deleted. Must be a new feature to windows 8.

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Re: Why pet battles fail

Postby Ryanpounce » January 28th, 2014, 6:42 pm

Btw my win chance against him is bout 50%

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Kpb321
 
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Re: Why pet battles fail

Postby Kpb321 » January 28th, 2014, 7:08 pm

I'd say that is an intended feature not a failure from blizzards perspective. A patch or two ago they tweaked a lot of abilities to change hit % and make things a little more random with less 100% chance to hit abilities. I'm not sure which abilities you are using or what order you are using your pets in but that seems like an odd team to me.

He starts with Carpe Diem so the yellow moth seems like the obvious choice but assuming it is a p/p moth your still going to need 4 rounds to kill him and if you use moth dust that 80% hit chance is going to hurt when you miss. His cleansing rain/Dreadful Breath is going to do a lot of team wide dmg to you during those 4 rounds. If that is what you are doing you'd probably be much better off using your Anubisath Idol first as sandstorm makes Carpe Diem a joke. The weather change removes the bonus dmg from dreadful breath and the dmg reduction means it's hitting for almost nothing.

I can pretty much two pet this fight with a Qiraji Guardling and Mechanical Pandaren Dragonling and don't recall ever failing with that team but any sandstorm pet should make the first pet trivial which in turn makes the rest of the fight pretty easy too.

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Re: Why pet battles fail

Postby Ryanpounce » January 28th, 2014, 7:33 pm

Kpb321 wrote:I'd say that is an intended feature not a failure from blizzards perspective. A patch or two ago they tweaked a lot of abilities to change hit % and make things a little more random with less 100% chance to hit abilities. I'm not sure which abilities you are using or what order you are using your pets in but that seems like an odd team to me.

He starts with Carpe Diem so the yellow moth seems like the obvious choice but assuming it is a p/p moth your still going to need 4 rounds to kill him and if you use moth dust that 80% hit chance is going to hurt when you miss. His cleansing rain/Dreadful Breath is going to do a lot of team wide dmg to you during those 4 rounds. If that is what you are doing you'd probably be much better off using your Anubisath Idol first as sandstorm makes Carpe Diem a joke. The weather change removes the bonus dmg from dreadful breath and the dmg reduction means it's hitting for almost nothing.

I can pretty much two pet this fight with a Qiraji Guardling and Mechanical Pandaren Dragonling and don't recall ever failing with that team but any sandstorm pet should make the first pet trivial which in turn makes the rest of the fight pretty easy too.


Well people need to be fired because my wise mari win chance is 50% blingatron win chance is 30% and shademaster win chance is 70% and the chance I'm going to beat all of them in one instance is fucking low as shit. about 10-12 attempts in now. Pet battles are just broken I'm about to just quit wow but it's my main source of fun, wtf blizz. I can't even post this on the real forums because I got banned. Pisses me off.

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Re: Why pet battles fail

Postby Ryanpounce » January 28th, 2014, 8:08 pm

About 20 attempts in, winning battles left and right. Every things pretty solid, got all of the fights down. Still haven't gotten past the first round, just something to think about...

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Re: Why pet battles fail

Postby Kpb321 » January 28th, 2014, 8:28 pm

Ryanpounce wrote:Every things pretty solid, got all of the fights down.

Still haven't gotten past the first round, just something to think about...


Those two statements seem contradictory. If you really had solid teams and a good strategy it wouldn't take more than 20 tires to get past the first 4 tamers.

Try the following team for Mari if you are still haven't problems
Start with Anubisath Idol
Keep sandstorm up and just spam an attack. You should kill the first pet with minimal damage taken by Anubisath Idol and the rest of your team. if you use Anubisath Idol for yula swap him out immediately when Mari dies or even the turn before Mari will die as long as sand storm has a couple rounds left.

Second bring in your Onyxia whelpling with tail sweep, healing flame and lift off. Use Tail Sweep to beat down the second pet healing as needed. Your slower and get the racial bonus so tail sweep should be hitting pretty hard and you should finish the fight pretty easily.

For the third pet stick with the whelpling and tail sweep the first round then lift off the second round when River will dive. You'll avoid the hit from dive but whirlpool will still hit, probably killing your whelpling. Now would be a good time to bring in your moth. Just make sure to use Cocoon Strike to absorb the second pump if your lift off missed. Otherwise you'll probably kill him before then.

Disclaimer, I haven't tried this team but it shouldn't have a problem and should win 80 or 90% of the time if not more. Worst case you are probably having to bring your Anubisath Idol back in to help finish off the second pet should something go wrong.

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Re: Why pet battles fail

Postby Ryanpounce » January 28th, 2014, 8:49 pm

Kpb321 wrote:
Ryanpounce wrote:Every things pretty solid, got all of the fights down.

Still haven't gotten past the first round, just something to think about...


Those two statements seem contradictory. If you really had solid teams and a good strategy it wouldn't take more than 20 tires to get past the first 4 tamers.

Try the following team for Mari if you are still haven't problems
Start with Anubisath Idol
Keep sandstorm up and just spam an attack. You should kill the first pet with minimal damage taken by Anubisath Idol and the rest of your team. if you use Anubisath Idol for yula swap him out immediately when Mari dies or even the turn before Mari will die as long as sand storm has a couple rounds left.

Second bring in your Onyxia whelpling with tail sweep, healing flame and lift off. Use Tail Sweep to beat down the second pet healing as needed. Your slower and get the racial bonus so tail sweep should be hitting pretty hard and you should finish the fight pretty easily.

For the third pet stick with the whelpling and tail sweep the first round then lift off the second round when River will dive. You'll avoid the hit from dive but whirlpool will still hit, probably killing your whelpling. Now would be a good time to bring in your moth. Just make sure to use Cocoon Strike to absorb the second pump if your lift off missed. Otherwise you'll probably kill him before then.

Disclaimer, I haven't tried this team but it shouldn't have a problem and should win 80 or 90% of the time if not more. Worst case you are probably having to bring your Anubisath Idol back in to help finish off the second pet should something go wrong.


I don't wanna scrap the idea you just gave me but I have the teams down, besides I'm using the idol in a different fight. Right now I'm around 30 attempts in and my win rate in the first round against all of them seem to be like 70%. The 30% accounts for me missing or them critting.

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Re: Why pet battles fail

Postby Kpb321 » January 28th, 2014, 9:10 pm

Up to you.

The Idol should be usable in another fight especially if you choose to use an ae heal to top him back off. I suggest him just because sandstorm really is that good against the first pet.

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Re: Why pet battles fail

Postby Liopleurodon » January 28th, 2014, 9:13 pm

To be completely frank, if your win rate is low, you need to try a different pet or combination of pets. The strategy you have in your pocket might be functional or work for somebody else, but it's clearly not working for you. And no, just because it's working for you doesn't mean it's broken or somebody has to lose their job.

On a more helpful note, I'm curious about what you're using for Blingtron. I use a strider, a crab and a fel flame, all of which you have at your disposal.
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Re: Why pet battles fail

Postby Se5s » January 28th, 2014, 9:31 pm

lol dat blingtron...i made my post in your other post, Ryan. hope you get through it with some hair left :x

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Re: Why pet battles fail

Postby Ryanpounce » January 28th, 2014, 10:06 pm

Liopleurodon wrote:To be completely frank, if your win rate is low, you need to try a different pet or combination of pets. The strategy you have in your pocket might be functional or work for somebody else, but it's clearly not working for you. And no, just because it's working for you doesn't mean it's broken or somebody has to lose their job.

On a more helpful note, I'm curious about what you're using for Blingtron. I use a strider, a crab and a fel flame, all of which you have at your disposal.


Basically how I go about it. Except I go double crab. At this point the one with the humanoid, undead, and wolf is the one with my lowest win rate so that's what I'm concerned about atm. I'd appreciate tips for that because when my undead dot for 500 is supposed to tick and when I'm supposed to use my burst ability on my current pet are about to go down he used it. All in all it negates 1400 damage because he's faster and in that time frame 2 of my pets die and by then the mechanical pets comes back out (was stunned) and kills my remaining pet because of that damage mechanical whether and turret. I would change it but the way in which I have to operate to win is so tight that if I were to change it I would suffer even more because of another problem. So basically my total percentage vs his total percentage of health goes from 220% vs 90% to 30% vs 40% all because of one fucking ability. And I'm not even exaggerating at all. In case you're wondering I use valkyr, kun lai runt, and idol. I use valyk for dots, runt to blow people up and idol to counter the weather. And I just cycle them like that. This is my pvp team and they are all in the top 4 best battle pets in wow. I basically use this team as a "one size fits all" kind of deal and use it for the toughest trainers, idk why I can't use it here.

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Re: Why pet battles fail

Postby Ryanpounce » January 28th, 2014, 10:13 pm

Se5s wrote:lol dat blingtron...i made my post in your other post, Ryan. hope you get through it with some hair left :x


Yeah me too lol.

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Re: Why pet battles fail

Postby Tuatha » January 28th, 2014, 10:33 pm

This is end game content for pet battles. As was stated in your other thread, do a little research and spend some time leveling pets with move sets that counter the pets your going against and the tourney is trivial. I did it this morning in about 20 minutes. It's not broken.

Did you look at the WoWHead Guide many of us directed you to in that other thread?

I assume you understand that your Xu-Fu's Moonlight increases the damage of Spirus, so you're not using that. But even so, Xu-Fu is great against some pve content, but you really want either a mechanical in there to take less damage, or something to cause dragonkin damage. Ideally, both, which is why that guide suggests the Mechanical Pandaren Dragonling. You can probably get that off the AH for a nominal investment, or use the Fel Flame you already have, as mentioned above. You'll see a huge improvement with that substitution.

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Re: Why pet battles fail

Postby Kpb321 » January 28th, 2014, 10:45 pm

For Shademaster Kiryn you seem to be missing all my go to pets but this seems to be the best team.

Lofty Libram- (2/2/2)
Open with Doom, then shock, then Amp, then shock two mores Doom should hit with amp still up and should finish him off and I think the libram will last that long. Trying to get doom to hit with amp up for the extra dmg.

Emp crab- use shell shield to minimize damage from the call lightning and his batter. Use your heals liberally as you want to make sure you last enough rounds after finishing him off for the turrets to drop and call lighting to wear off because those will tear up a pet with out a shield. BTW an elemental spider from deepholm works even better here and is relatively high level if you want to make the fight easier on yourself.

The other option for the second slot is the water waveling as it can use Tidal Wave to wipe out the turrets.

For the last pet you can go mechanical like the clockwork gnome or lil bling or possibly a flyer like Effervescent Glowfly, Green Wing Macaw, Imperial Eagle Chick or Yellow moth. Just make sure to dodge/block the prowled bite.

For this fight you really need either something that can power through is first pet and kill it before the call of winter starts eating up your entire team with it's extra dmg when everyone is chilled or you need to force him to swap out. A stun works or something like a creepy crate or claw works. I use a darkmoon monkey that is faster than him to stun him to force the switch.


EDIT
I just tried this with Libram, Emp and clockwork and won on my first try. Doom with amp up did kill the first pet even tho I missed one of the shocks. The emp was able to kill the second pet and last long enough for all the turrets to die and eat the first prowl/bite. Clockwork finished him off with hps to spare and didn't even need to rez.
Last edited by Kpb321 on January 28th, 2014, 11:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Why pet battles fail

Postby Tuatha » January 28th, 2014, 10:55 pm

Ryanpounce wrote:At this point the one with the humanoid, undead, and wolf is the one with my lowest win rate so that's what I'm concerned about atm. I'd appreciate tips for that because when my undead dot for 500 is supposed to tick and when I'm supposed to use my burst ability on my current pet are about to go down he used it. All in all it negates 1400 damage because he's faster and in that time frame 2 of my pets die and by then the mechanical pets comes back out (was stunned) and kills my remaining pet because of that damage mechanical whether and turret.


Okay, that sounds like Kiryn, except it's a mechanical, not undead. He was kind of a pain and the WoWHead guide uses a couple hard to get pets.

You might be able to get away with Harbinger of Flame (2,2,2), Water Waveling (2,1,1), and Lil' Bling (1,1,1). Basically, I just looked at the Collected Celestial Tournament Undercard Strategy thread and found a pet for each of the three positions that you already have. You can sometimes mix and match from that thread.

The Harbinger should be able to take down Nairn, the Waveling's Tidal Wave makes Stormoen's turrets much less of a problem, and Lil' Bling should be able to take down what's left of Summer (let the Waveling soften Summer up first).

Good luck!

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Re: Why pet battles fail

Postby Ryanpounce » January 28th, 2014, 11:25 pm

Tuatha wrote:
Ryanpounce wrote:At this point the one with the humanoid, undead, and wolf is the one with my lowest win rate so that's what I'm concerned about atm. I'd appreciate tips for that because when my undead dot for 500 is supposed to tick and when I'm supposed to use my burst ability on my current pet are about to go down he used it. All in all it negates 1400 damage because he's faster and in that time frame 2 of my pets die and by then the mechanical pets comes back out (was stunned) and kills my remaining pet because of that damage mechanical whether and turret.


Okay, that sounds like Kiryn, except it's a mechanical, not undead. He was kind of a pain and the WoWHead guide uses a couple hard to get pets.

You might be able to get away with Harbinger of Flame (2,2,2), Water Waveling (2,1,1), and Lil' Bling (1,1,1). Basically, I just looked at the Collected Celestial Tournament Undercard Strategy thread and found a pet for each of the three positions that you already have. You can sometimes mix and match from that thread.

The Harbinger should be able to take down Nairn, the Waveling's Tidal Wave makes Stormoen's turrets much less of a problem, and Lil' Bling should be able to take down what's left of Summer (let the Waveling soften Summer up first).

Good luck!

Thanks

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Re: Why pet battles fail

Postby Luciandk » January 29th, 2014, 2:05 am

OP, you give up too fast. Dont blame it on the game if you dont use your pets right.

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Re: Why pet battles fail

Postby Haevlyn » January 29th, 2014, 5:40 am

Wise Mari (if it's the one i'm thinking of - not done CT in months now)
Any Flying pet with Call Darkness on round 2 to minimize healing for the fish. Alpha Strike to finish it off.
Scourged Whelp for the magic pet. Due to it's undead nature, you get an additional attack.

I forget which pet I used third as half the time it only jumped in to finish off the last hit on the last pet.

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Re: Why pet battles fail

Postby Digem » January 29th, 2014, 7:14 am

He is dying a lot because he is using the wrong pets here so it is not a solid team
In this fight first choice to use is a crow or a raven call darkness reduces healing and nocturnal strike and alpha strike destroy him .
If one does not choose to use the help guides and do their own thing with only 55 pets whenthisis END game content meant to be tough like raiding I don't want to hear your whining.
Put the work in get the right pets ready for the CT.
Also have backups many pets have near same abilities this isn't suppose to be easy.

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Re: Why pet battles fail

Postby Khazure » January 29th, 2014, 7:58 am

The randomness is what keeps people trying out new teams. If it was all set in stone everyone would be using the same team and pet battles would fail. The tournament is all strategy and a lot of fun if u put in the work and have a large pool of pets to choose from. Rng will always be there so those that put in the bare minimum effort will struggle. You can't halfway gear up and raid end game and you can't halfway focus on pets and be successful at pet battle and game. If rng didn't exist you could script every battle and know the outcome before you even started.

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