Well that didn't take long...

[Faelar]

I mean sure I guess there is a remote possibility of it but it does not really seem likely. If Blizz wanted a crapton more money now that the TCG game is out of print and they own the rights they could put all of the TCG pets on the Blizz store and cash in something fierce. There is no reason for Blizz to go through any middleman when it comes to pets/mounts/services.

The ones that DO benefit from this shady crap, are gold sellers.

[Allandel]

Oh no. I just bought a Tuskar Kite off Ebay last week for $94 in hope I'll get a Vh but looks like I've lost money on that deal

[Peanutty]

The rule with pet "investments" now is trade 'em fast. I pretty much look for a 24 hr turnaround on any pets I want to resell/trade since I don't know what will change by the next day. The Vengeful Porcupettes were a good example of how quickly the market could sour in a short period of time, and that wasn't even from duping!

For your Tuskarr Kite maybe you could trade the code itself for a VH? Some traders might be willing to do better trades if they know they're getting the real deal. Doesn't hurt to try I guess?

[Faelar]

Well Allandel the silver lining is that VH appeared to get a 2nd dupe wave so they are cheaper on a number of realms as well. There was a 50k one on my realm with many other realms having similar prices.

[Nightabsm]

.....WHAT IF....it's an inside job?......

Like what if, Blizzard is actually spreading the pets in game to flood the market and bring down the price of the pets on Ebay...

Could this even be a possibility?

I had acquired extra Wind RIder Cubs, when they said they were available for a limited time and paid a whole lot extra. Then they brought it back. But now everyone has a chance to have them....

The few of us who are lucky enough to acquire these pets and then extras of them to trade is a lot more fewer than the people who have gotten these pets from dupes and are happy with them. [No real numbers here, but by the looks of how many people have them now, like EVERYONE can have one...]

Could it be an inside job? =X

I've thought the same for awhile. Could be Blizzard attempting to make a larger public happy, create a large gold dump, etc.
Though, it probably is just hackers sadly. Lol.

[Faelar]

Blizz wanting to make a larger public happy? Then they'd re-release blizzcon/ce pets in the store and go CA-CHING all the way to the millions of dollars they'd rake in for no work.

[Pettea]

I'd totally purchase these pets for gold. If an in-game pet costs so much money outside the game, that's far more crazy. Plus I use the auction house in good faith, there is no way to know if something was 'duped', if that's even possible.

I'm all for making these pets more accessible.

Blizz wanting to make a larger public happy? Then they'd re-release blizzcon/ce pets in the store and go CA-CHING all the way to the millions of dollars they'd rake in for no work.

That's an option. Although I do feel 10 euros for one in-game pet is expensive.

[Faelar]

I'm all for making these pets more accessible.

So you are perfectly fine with pets being duped all over the place as long as you are able to get all of the ones you are missing? I personally don't feel that the group that should be benefiting the most from all of this is the gold sellers. They've done so much crap over the years to make the game suck at times.

[Pettea]

I'm all for making these pets more accessible.

So you are perfectly fine with pets being duped all over the place as long as you are able to get all of the ones you are missing? I personally don't feel that the group that should be benefiting the most from all of this is the gold sellers. They've done so much crap over the years to make the game suck at times.

I don't think that's too relevant. I'm fine with purchasing in-game companions with in-game funds, even if they're level six. These pets are too rare, I can only hope they're duped a lot to increase availability.

I feel us collectors benefit from an increased supply, as more companions come into reach.

I'm not quite sure why any collector can get upset about this either, how does this affect a collector that already has one. Sure, the price of the companion may drop, but you weren't planning on putting it back onto the market either way. If you only enjoy things that others can't have: I'm not sure what to say about that.

Either way: I feel an increased supply is beneficial, I doubt duping exists, and players certainly do not have any methods to check for 'dupes', nor do I feel they should have to.

[Faelar]

I don't even know where to start with THAT reply but here we go.

*You hope they are duped to increase availability? You have got to be kidding me. You are fine with pet dupes because it fills out your collection? Eventually it will be to the point you have a collection of pets that EVERYONE has and it just takes away from the collecting as there are not many 'rare' things to collect. Imagine Coin collecting but EVERYONE had access to the oldest and most sought after coins. What would happen then? Coin collecting would lose most of the fun because collecting would be pointless if everyone had everything.

*Collectors like having a collection that has value. I was proud to have a collection that at one time was worth over 1 million gold. I mean hell I used to use a team of Spectral Tiger Cub, Dragon Kite and Ethereal Soul-Trader. I called it team half a million because back then those 3 pets would fetch an easy 500k for me. Now? Those pets I could get for around 100k TOTAL. So my collection looks far less impressive as it is not worth as much.

*You doubt duping exists? Do you remember the flood of all of those level 6 spectral cubs last year? Do you remember when blizzard claimed they were 'compromised accounts'. Tell me. How many accounts in the world last year do you think had a Spectral Tiger Cub? Now how many of those accounts do you think had only level 6 cubs? Not level 25 cubs. Not level 1 cubs. Level 6 cubs. All of them.

Is there a chance these pets are legit? Sure there is a chance. Is there a chance these pets are duped? I'd say the evidence would point much more strongly in this direction.

Also feel free to update your profile with a higher level character because I'd love to see your pet collection. Instead you are posting on a sub level 10 character and a fairly new account on WCP. I know I'm curious to know who I'm talking to so I can see their collection and how invested they are into pets.

[Angelwings626]

I totally understand both sides here.

And I understand that some of the people here are a bit more competitive about their collections.


To put it a bit more sensitive towards people who place a high value on non-duped pets.....Please keep this in mind...


Before the duping started, people who wanted these rare TCG pets worked very hard trying to acquire them. They bought cards, they watched ebay for deals, they bargained with people and worked very hard to get these pets. When they had it...IE Spectral Tiger Cub, EST, Rocket Chicken, etc, it was a sign of how much they cared about what they were collecting.

Now with the Gold Sellers hacking and creating these pets, it really is disheartening for these people who worked so hard to make impressive collections. It wasn't hard work that created it. They aren't even real players, these people are profiting from the game by cheating.....

So....

Although I am happy that everyone can now get these pets, you must also keep in mind that these pets were very hard to get at one point and the people who originally had them got them either through luck, lots of money, or hard work.

[Hausdorff]

I don't think that's too relevant. I'm fine with purchasing in-game companions with in-game funds, even if they're level six. These pets are too rare, I can only hope they're duped a lot to increase availability.

I feel us collectors benefit from an increased supply, as more companions come into reach.

I'm not quite sure why any collector can get upset about this either, how does this affect a collector that already has one. Sure, the price of the companion may drop, but you weren't planning on putting it back onto the market either way. If you only enjoy things that others can't have: I'm not sure what to say about that.

Either way: I feel an increased supply is beneficial, I doubt duping exists, and players certainly do not have any methods to check for 'dupes', nor do I feel they should have to.

I'm much more of a collector than I am a trader/seller, and I definitely have to disagree with this. Part of my interest in pet collecting is acquiring rare/valuable pets. Even if I have no intent to sell my Rocket Chicken, I still benefit from its rarity as its presence makes my collection more impressive. I would hate to see it duped and suddenly 3x as many people have one. I don't think this is selfish, it's just part of what collecting is about.

If I buy into your argument, then it can be extended to basically anything. Who cares if my house loses value after I bought it? I'm not planning on selling it anyway! I imagine most people don't feel this way.

[Faelar]

Ah yeah the housing analogy is another perfect example. The thing with most collections is that they gain value over time because they get further and further away from the origin date of whatever it is. Meaning if a coin was created in 1908 it is worth FAR more in 2014 than it would have been in 1980 because more time has passed.

In the case of pets like Rocket Chicken each day that goes by can potentially increase its value because you are that much further removed from the TCG which created these pets. (Yes I know they sometimes show up on the BMAH, just using this is as an example pet.)

Also very well put Angel, you nailed it on how I view collecting as well.

[Angelwings626]

=D I like that this topic could turn into a very deep conversation about how people place value on things.

If you take a step back and look at all the pieces....

The item [IN GAME PET/NON-TANGIBLE/SIGN OF STATUS ]

The Value

The Demand

The Haves

The Have Nots.

Its really quite interested and I hope those who feel bad, do not spend too much time dwelling on this.

[Faelar]

Just be thankful this isn't the official WoW forums, it can get much worse over there.

I think the only thing I am dwelling on is if it is worth it for me to even bother with any pet that has a value over like 10k. Because any pet over this number has a big shot of just suddenly popping up. I mean the prime target for this next wave would be Rocket Chicken and/or Hippogryph Hatchling. Eventually it will get to the point that you have a lot of 10k pets like the small TCGs and then 20k pets like EST/rocket chicken/bananas/spec kitty/etc.

It was a bit sour to work hard on a trade for a Tuskarr Kite and then 3 or 4 days later I just lose 60k gold in value because suddenly 200 kites flood into the markets. I'd have been totally fine with it if it was some gradual increase you could see happening on underminejournal....but nope. Went from like 15 kites horde side to 110 in no time at all. THAT is one of the biggest problems I had with it. That crap is just sudden.

All it does is kill my desire to do trading because there is always a chance that the things I have become near worthless. And I can say this and have plenty of people back me up. I've done plenty of trades in the past few months where I break even or even give slightly more than a pet is worth to help out someone's collection. I've told plenty of people that X trade was too far in my favor and added things to balance it out.

I mean my pet collection is as done as it can be. I have millions of gold which I've had before I ever started pet trading. I've got plenty of bnet balance, 2 years of game time, everything I could ever want in WoW. I am not in this for massive profit but at the same time I ENJOY the haggling and trading aspect of pets and I like having pets with good value so I can get some huge bundle of pets to turn around and make more deals happen. If you remove more valuable pets with duped pets that have not much worth then the trading values go down and it is harder for people to get things for collections.

[Pettea]

Coin collecting would lose most of the fun because collecting would be pointless if everyone had everything.

I don't know, I guess I mostly enjoy making wacky teams and strategies and sharing them. I think coin collectors would all be much happier if they all had access to the rare coins they were looking for. I'd be! It's a bit of a parabole to turn "more accessible" into "accessible right away for everyone instantly" though These pets generally don't take skill or work to obtain, they just take lots of money and ebay. But I guess we perceive collecting differently, like I suggested before: you're someone that draws pleasure from having something that others can not, because they can not have it. I understand it can make you feel special, since you own something noone else has. You had that a while now though, didn't you? Isn't it okay to lift that monopoly? There will be more companions like that, which you can then collect and have for others to glare it.

Certainly you wouldn't want such a situation to endure indefinitely? How much is your own pleasure worth in comparison to that of many others? Plus like I said, you can move on to new pets! /curious!

I trade for things for the value that I want to give for them. You should not feel bad if you pay 100 euros for an item that the next week is sold for 50 euros. You were happy when you paid 100 euros. Neither should you cheer when it sells for 150 the week after. You're not trying to speculate on a market, right?

PS. How would you feel about a feature that added a date obtained to the pet? Would that sate some of your uniqueness condition?

I totally understand both sides here.

Is there any evidence that companions actually have been 'duplicated' as some call it? And isn't it a bit like when you complete the Half Hills achievement for the Red Cricket and you happily find two in your mailbox somehow?

These pets are still pretty impossible for me to obtain I might add, I can't afford tens of thousands of gold

...

Others can't see your collection though (sadly). Perhaps the Garrison will allow some functionality here, although apparently a friend list is required.

...

Still, the prices of these pets - TCG pets you have to buy with actual money - and they can go up to a hundred euros I think, which feels a tad silly. They're more or less unobtainable unless you're rich outside the game, and have no real method of being obtained in the game. Also anniversary pets, and several others, it's just a pity. It'd be nice if these things were somehow obtainable in the game.

But sometimesI also wish all pets were cageable. So you could make your own pet emperium It would probably swamp the auction house a bit though.

On a sort of different note, on all this collecting: I've ran into the 1000 pet limit a while ago and now have around a hundred pets caged, which is extremely annoying. Any chance we can start some kind of lobby so that they remove this silly limit? They already have a per pet limit anyway, so it's a bit ridiculous I have to manage a paper list as well.

[Faelar]

The thing with pet collecting/coin collecting is that some of like to have the most valuable collection or the most rare things in the collection. If the rarity of things changes to the point of every person being able to have a certain pet then it makes the collections feel the same. I know I would not enjoy pet collecting very much if everyone had 600 unique pets, there is no thrill in that of having an impressive character with a great pet collection. I have plenty of things outside of pets which set me apart from others but the pet collection I had was a great sense of pride as I worked very hard to get it and maintain it. Now with these pets all over the place it is like "Yay, I have a good pet collection...big deal". The sense of joy isn't as strong anymore.

[Angelwings626]

I totally understand both sides here.

Is there any evidence that companions actually have been 'duplicated' as some call it? And isn't it a bit like when you complete the Half Hills achievement for the Red Cricket and you happily find two in your mailbox somehow?

These pets are still pretty impossible for me to obtain I might add, I can't afford tens of thousands of gold

Excellent question.

This is the main reason why this is even an issue. I believe if we could prove this and show what is happening to Blizzard they would indeed put a stop to it. Not because they don't want people to have the pets, but because they are getting the gold from the sales to sell online.

I have been doing a little digging on my end on these level one sellers. It's rather interesting.

The person / persons have mutilple accounts. One spams trade and one actually holds the pet. If you respond to the person who is selling in trade they tell you to hold on, for two minutes.....

After two minutes, a second account logs. This person is the one that takes all the money. They keep logging in new accounts with each buy.

This is why it's hard to report them. The person spamming is different than the person taking the gold and holding the pet.

If you ask this person how many they have, they usually will ask you how many you need.....

=C Now you may tell me that this is not enough evidence to prove they are dupes, but right here something is not right.

As you know, prior to the duping situation, you get TCG pets [Spectral Tiger/EST] though the cards....1 in 264 Booster packs........ And now the game is out of print......main source is now ebay.....

ANYHOW....SO... I was trolling them, and put 900k in their trade window....So he/she kept talking to me. Told me "she" was a beautician.....HAH. They want to talk on skype.....VERY strange behavior. Shoot, now I'm just rambling.

But back to your question. Cannot prove. BUT, if they have 6 sets of EST/SPECTRAL CUBS/V. HORRORS somethings not right....

[Faelar]

Yeah this isn't the first time I've heard about people wanting to talk on skype when it comes to these pets either. I've had a few people I've done pet trades with mention that they could put me in contact with someone via skype because I was looking for various TCG pets. I totally back away from any of that crap as I like my account far too much to do something that stupid.

As far as the low level people in trade chat selling pets. I used to inspect them when they'd spam trade. They almost ALWAYS had 10 or 20 achievement points with the only 2 achievements being "Going Down" for falling 65 yards and the one for collecting your first pet. I'm not always in trade chat but most of the time now these pets are just put on the AH by level 1 characters that are online for less than a minute or two at most.

These pets smell so fishy it is just waaaaay to shady to me. I really wish Blizzard would look in to it. Maybe these pets are legit, but when people start wanting to 'talk in skype' or have accounts with 20 achievement points selling pets or only use level 1's to list pets and then make new level 1's to sell other pets a day later....too many red flags for me.

I think it is simply Blizzard just does not have the man power to deal with this. I mean this would be my type of job though. Investigating pet duping, following the gold, getting tons of people banned all at once and cleaning this crap up. The reality is though Blizzard customer service is total garbage compared to what it used to be. I mean with a playerbase in the millions you really cannot spend much time investigating low level pet sellers even if they are flipping this gold for money.